Has any one taken Porsche to the small claim court about their IMS flaw? There is a victory for Honda Civic Hydrid owner on CA. I love the fact that no lawyer allows in this court!! Tonyhttp://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,14959#msg-14959Thu, 23 May 2013 08:55:30 -0600 Phorum 5.2.16-RC1 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15338#msg-15338 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15338#msg-15338
Sorry you don't appreciate the legal discussion - I offered to take it off line but was encouraged to continue because several people expressed in interest in continuing it. All I have done is to express my opinion that a small claims court action would probably ultimately be futile. That is not to say it is impossible to prevail - but IMO, unlikely. Even a victory there would likely be reversed upon repeal. That's my opinion - take it or leave it. It is worth what you are paying for it.

BTW, I have been in small claims court many, many times and have always prevailed. In cases where I thought my client was clearly wrong, I did as you suggested and had my client write a check at arbitration. Luckily, that was pretty rare. In this case, I don't think Porsche is legally wrong - although there are good business arguments that they ought to pay some of the claims for "good will" reasons.

I think we have exhausted this subject. Good luck with your claims.

mike]]> Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumSat, 18 Feb 2012 19:38:18 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15331#msg-15331 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15331#msg-15331
All I can say is that it's cheap and simple to file a small claims action in my state. I think that was the idea behind the original post, bit it appears the discussion may have gone a bit overboard. (It's a good think Pedro doesn't have to pay for all this legal advice by the hour. ;)) I've had to file suits twice (and have won both times), once against a very large Manhattan commercial real estate firm that was dragging its feet in returning a security deposit for office space we had rented. The poor guy they sent down to the court clearly didn't want to be there and when an arbitrator came in, he whipped out his checkbook and paid what he owed, plus court costs. We never even went before a judge and we were out of there in no time. All we wanted to do was get our money from the deadbeats and we succeeded by making life a little difficult for them. That's what it's about, unlike the ridiculous poster who claimed it was "vengeance." It's nothing of the sort.]]> longislander1 Main ForumSat, 18 Feb 2012 15:54:43 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15197#msg-15197 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15197#msg-15197 Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumWed, 15 Feb 2012 19:58:33 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15192#msg-15192 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15192#msg-15192jalopnik.com]. Lawdevil, it sounds like you might have approved of Honda's approach to the case, but it apparently didn't work.

I don't think you can assume anything in small claims court if you're well-prepared and have a decent case. It's sort of like the person who takes their car to the dealer, asks for a "goodwill adjustment" and is pleasantly surprised to get a free repair from the manufacturer. A different person might have gone in there and remained silent, assuming there would be no goodwill offered. The woman with the Honda could have dismissed the idea of a small claims suit, assuming she couldn't possibly win.

If you don't ask, you don't get.]]> longislander1 Main ForumWed, 15 Feb 2012 17:10:39 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15189#msg-15189 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15189#msg-15189 Gary in SoFL Main ForumWed, 15 Feb 2012 16:15:38 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15186#msg-15186 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15186#msg-15186
If vengeance is your primary goal, go for it! I have better things to do.

mike]]> Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumWed, 15 Feb 2012 13:01:28 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15179#msg-15179 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15179#msg-15179
And I would never pay expert witnesses to come to small claims court. That's plain stupid. But there are plenty of published statements by Anderson, Raby and maybe others regarding the defect. I would package that up neatly for the judge and would include bios of each to show their expertise.

Perhaps some lawyers look at the viability of cases based on their need to turn a profit. I look at small claims as a low-cost, civilized way to return the favor to those who have caused me trouble. Forcing the other party into the time and expense of a court appearance is sometimes victory enough. If you do nothing, you are guaranteeing the outcome will be against you so I always feel it's worth a try.]]> longislander1 Main ForumWed, 15 Feb 2012 10:09:26 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15169#msg-15169 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15169#msg-15169 Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumTue, 14 Feb 2012 21:03:32 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15159#msg-15159 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15159#msg-15159 Boxsterra Main ForumTue, 14 Feb 2012 16:03:45 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15143#msg-15143 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15143#msg-15143 Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumTue, 14 Feb 2012 09:30:45 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15142#msg-15142 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15142#msg-15142
I don't see why Bruce Anderson's and Jake Raby's public writings on IMS failures could not be used as expert opinion. If Porsche wants to dispute Anderson's contention that up to 20% of all cars could be affected, then the next question to the company would be "What is the correct percentage?" If Porsche declines to respond or says it is zero, well, there are scads of engine failure examples to challenge that. At some point, the company has to either confirm or deny that a defect exists. In fact, I recently saw a legal document from New Jersey in which a judge dismissed a class action suit against Porsche for a 911 engine failure. I believe the judge ruled that the car was too far out of warranty. However, within the document, Porsche said that it would only consider an out-of-warranty goodwill reimbursement if the car was bought new from an authorized dealer (which this 911 was not). That's the first and only time I've ever seen Porsche make a public pronouncement on the issue and I'm wonder if someone could submit that in small claims court as evidence of Porsche admitting the defect. However, I'm not a lawyer, so I'll bow to the experts (and not the Kool-Aid guzzlers, please), who can look at such a case objectively.

My feeling is that there's very little to lose in a small claims suit, assuming that you have the time to pull together the documented failures and expert opinions so that you can make a coherent presentation before a judge. If you're an engine failure victim and Porsche refuses to help you at all, why not give them a little trouble and inconvenience in return?]]> longislander1 Main ForumTue, 14 Feb 2012 08:41:45 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15033#msg-15033 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15033#msg-15033 Laz Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 11:15:51 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15032#msg-15032 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15032#msg-15032

marisa-tomei-1024x768-27273.jpg

]]> Gary in SoFL Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 11:13:08 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15031#msg-15031 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15031#msg-15031


]]> Laz Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 11:12:51 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15027#msg-15027 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15027#msg-15027 Laz Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 10:43:02 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15026#msg-15026 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15026#msg-15026
If these cases were ever to go to trial, as a plaintiff, I'd want Jake and his bearing expert to testify on the engineering side of the issue and as a defendant, I'd have some technical expert from Porsche (and the the bearing maker) along with video deps from Marc and others that have turned 100K + miles with this engine, doing regular maintenance and in some cases track events, with no kabooms.

I could see a judge throwing up his hands on this one-- information to support both sides and no clear statistics to deal with.]]> MikenOH Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 09:36:45 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15024#msg-15024 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15024#msg-15024My calendar is open.
Call to book me!
Happy Boxstering,
Pedrp]]> Pedro (Weston, FL) Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 08:02:40 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15022#msg-15022 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15022#msg-15022 Pedro (Weston, FL) Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 08:00:19 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15019#msg-15019 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15019#msg-15019
In the end, the only one who can answer these questions is a judge. The reason we are having an "academic" discussion -- instead of discussing why the judge ruled that Joe won his case or why Frank lost his case -- is most likely because we don't know of any actual rulings on it, yea or nay. It strains credibility to believe that nobody in this litigious country ever tried to sue over this issue even one time and that nobody ever whined about his judicial loss or bragged about his win. Sorry, I think Porsche is settling these with a confidentiality clause, which explains everything. Can I prove it? Nope, no more than either of us can prove our legal theories in this discussion.]]> paulwdenton Main ForumFri, 10 Feb 2012 06:21:37 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15017#msg-15017 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15017#msg-15017
One other issue that occurs to me is that after 6 or 7 years, many of these cars have probably changed hands. The second owner quite often purchased the car "as is". Should such an owner, despite the terms of his purchase, be able to bring an action against the manufacturer - and, if so, under what theory?

mike]]> Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 23:09:39 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15015#msg-15015 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15015#msg-15015 paulwdenton Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 20:05:10 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15014#msg-15014 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15014#msg-15014

mycousinvinnyquestioning.jpg

]]> Laz Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 19:42:15 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15013#msg-15013 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15013#msg-15013Just asking?]]> Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 18:07:59 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15012#msg-15012 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15012#msg-15012 paulwdenton Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 17:03:13 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15011#msg-15011 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15011#msg-15011Why would a mechanic's testimony be sufficient to show that there is a design defect? All it shows is that one car's IMS failed. A mechanic's testimony to that effect would not demonstrate why it failed, how it failed, whether there was a design defect or simply a mechanical failure from wear, stress or improper use.]]> danz76 Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 15:46:44 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15010#msg-15010 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15010#msg-15010 paulwdenton Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 14:48:20 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15008#msg-15008 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15008#msg-15008 Gary in SoFL Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 13:18:27 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15006#msg-15006 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15006#msg-15006
Assuming 200,000 M96 engines (I pulled this out of the air), how many have had failures beyond the warranty period? Of those, how many could you contact years after the occurrence? How many of those would be original owners? (Purchasers of used M96s would have even more trouble prevailing.) How many engine failures were IMS related and how would you prove that? How about proving that the cars were adequately maintained? Difficult in a class action. Some of the cars are almost 15 years old - I have doubt that a court would force a manufacturer to guarantee cars that old? This is without reference to the almost certain disclaimers Porsche made in the warranty materials when the car was purchased.

Regardless of the merit of any such claim, it does not seem to me that many attorneys wold have much interest in pursuing such a monumental undertaking. This is not a sexy case like the Ford Pintos with cars bursting into flames. There is not even much PR appeal in representing a bunch of folks who have the disposable income to purchase these very expensive play-things.

mike]]> Lawdevil & CURVN8R Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 12:50:55 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15003#msg-15003 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15003#msg-15003
If it wasn't for lawyers, we wouldn't need them. B)]]> Gary in SoFL Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 12:41:51 -0700 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15001#msg-15001 http://pedrosboard.com/read.php?7,14959,15001#msg-15001
I know of someone who tried to interest a lawyer (who had been the lead counsel in a successful class action lawsuit against an auto company) in taking up the IMS issue and he offered to put the lawyer in touch with potential lead plaintiffs and witnesses. There was no interest. When I heard this, I figured the lawyer must know something my friend didn't.]]> mikefocke, '01S Sanford, NC Main ForumThu, 09 Feb 2012 11:54:23 -0700