Discs... disc brakes... ABS

... and even though the engine will still be a flat boxer, it'll be a flat four, turbo.

[www.autoweek.com]

I've always thought that there's no replacement for displacement, but I could be convinced otherwise.
Let's wait and see.
Happy Porscheing,
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 311,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]
PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)

---

Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

Turbos broke .... a lot.

Now, turbos are becoming ubiquitous. BMW has turbos in both their in-line 6 and 4. The turbo 4 has replaced its legendary naturally aspirated inline 6.

The 4 is powerful and efficient, though not as smooth, nor as sonorous.

What I wonder about it long term reliability. Will they last well beyond the warranty? Will they last as long as naturally aspirated engines? In these days of leases and disposable everything, does anyone care?

Turbos used to break a lot because some of them were running at 90,000RPM trying to force feed 1bar of boost or more. Today's turbos run at about 0.7bar of boost and there's a lot better materials understanding regarding heat dissipation, to say nothing of far better fuel dispersion and control, so today's turbos are going to be more reliable.

What is not more reliable, however, IMHO, are the electronics presently in every car. There are the engine computers, the suspension computers, the fuel management units, the steering algorithms, the braking sensors etc., to say nothing of the security, the climate control, the audio systems.

So, what used to be a case of largely mechanical elements in a car, it's all a bunch of boards that, quite frankly, remain expensive over time, and difficult for third parties to reproduce. So the lack of reliability will not be mechanical, but will be a result of electronic failure. The classic example -- we have a photocopier in the office, of which all of the mechanical elements work just fine. The logic board is gone, and a new logic board is more money than the copier is worth.

Same with cars.

3 rules:

1. easy when cold
2. cool dow when hot
3. superior lubrication


But loose talk such as that could start an oil thread and nobody wants that. :-)

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Grant, have you been spending a lot of time working with solvents??

We're LONG overdue for an oily thread.

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Quote
Roger987
Grant, have you been spending a lot of time working with solvents??

We're LONG overdue for an oily thread.

Yep, it's been way to quiet on this board, lately; time to roll the 'which oil is best" thread out and watch the fireworks .

but this is the kind of announcement that can get prospective buyers to sit on the side lines until the 911-like power shows up.

I say that because the notion of having that kind of power in a Boxster/Cayman package has been thought about since the models were introduced.

A Cayman with 395 HP would be an absolute rocket and the cost effective track toy of choice, although the turbo power delivery might not be everyone's cup of tea..

Next to the Boxsters I've owned, the most fun I've ever had with a car has been my '91 MR2 Turbo. And that was "only" 200HP. I always loved the sound and feel of the turbo spinning up. I would definitely be a buyer of one of these.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2014 09:56PM by Leor ('09S, North of Boston). (view changes)

I also own an '87 944 Turbo track car with a big K27-8 turbo. I love the feeling / sound when it boosts up! Quite addictive!

Ok Porsche this is getting ridiculous . .I would be thrilled with a GTS, wait...I would be thrilled with the 981, wait I am thrilled with a 987 and the 986 is pretty cool as well

I guess what I am saying is driving any model of the Boxster is Blast and any of the Boxsters models can definitely can out perform my driving abilities. I am going hang on to the money that I don't have and be thrilled.

Mike

MIKELLIG

Less weight of course means better acceleration, braking, and cornering.

Wouldn't the weight of the turbo(s) and plumbing bring the combined package back to the same ballpark as the 6?

The cylinder head is made of solid metal. Additionally, the extra cylinders necessitate other changes too such bigger intake and exhaust manifolds, more spark plugs, ignition coils, bigger oil and coolant capacity. I would (wild ass) guess they can make it 50-75 lbs. lighter.

That's a lot of horsepower. Too much for most people.

Sort of like "too much hard disk space" ???

When ABS first became available, there were objections by some that it would cause accidents, particularly rear-enders, because the car so equipped would stop much sooner than the following one.

Funny... I find the most 'dangerous' component on my Boxster S are the brakes. 'Dangerous' in the sense that when I've needed to come to a quick stop on the highway (due to slowing traffic), my eyes are firmly in the rear view mirror to determine whether the driver behind me has also started to slow (especially if it's an SUV, if only because of their higher CG and long stopping distances). On more than one occasion I've needed to ease the brake pressure to avoid being rear ended! Be safe out there...

Quote
jlegelis
Funny... I find the most 'dangerous' component on my Boxster S are the brakes. 'Dangerous' in the sense that when I've needed to come to a quick stop on the highway (due to slowing traffic), my eyes are firmly in the rear view mirror to determine whether the driver behind me has also started to slow (especially if it's an SUV, if only because of their higher CG and long stopping distances). On more than one occasion I've needed to ease the brake pressure to avoid being rear ended! Be safe out there...

Just one of the reasons driving is a full time activity. I constantly gauge the distance in front and behind to leave myself a safety cushion. When stopping at a light, I leave about a car length between me and the car in front. More then once, I've avoided being rear ended by being able to move forward and giving someone behind enough room to stop.

Thankful that I have the brakes that Porsche provides.

Everyone was barreling along in the fast lane on Route 95 North near Burlington, MA a few years ago, and up ahead of me I saw traffic coming to a sudden halt. I knew that I could stop the Boxster in the space I had, barely, but I had a lot less confidence in the beat-up car following behind me a bit too close for comfort. Fortunately, there was a shoulder, so I pulled out into it as I was slowing down a bit less than at full possible decelleration (since there was a bit more room in the shoulder before some sort of obstruction.)

The guy behind me took my lead and followed me into the shoulder, stopping about 5 feet from my tail, both of us now at least a couple of car lengths past the stopped traffic in the the lane we used to be in and with me a few feet from the barrier in front of me on the shoulder.

I got out and high-fived the guy behind me, as we had both dodged an ugly bullet there. As we were chatting, a truck driver a few lanes over who'd watched the entire thing stuck his head out as he was passing us and yelled, "HOLY CR@P !!!!" which is pretty much how I was feeling at that point, lol!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2014 09:17AM by Leor ('09S, North of Boston). (view changes)

It's too much HP. I recently bought a 996 turbo and sold my boxster and all I'll say is the power is out of this world. I use to think that there was no such thing as too much hp, but this car definitely has too much power at least more than I have been accustomed to. It's a great vehicle though.

The way it was phrased I thought read (who knows with translation) up to 395 HP. "Up to" being key. That would be at the end of the 981.2's life span in a Cayman R, methinks.

One thing is for sure, the 981s are not going to be allowed to generate numbers as good as the base Carreras. They will be kept in line in MSRP order. So until the base Carrera gets faster, neither will the 981s.

I can't see the 911 having anything but a flat 6 in it, so they will need to go to a smaller displacement flat 6 with most likely a turbo. It also won't be an expensive variable vane titanium turbo like the "Turbo" model gets, so the low end isn't going to be quite the same, and expect some more lag. Figure maybe 2.7L for the base Carrera, 3.0L for the S, with the Turbo Turbo remaining 3.8 as long as they can manage.

If you haven't looked at the CAFE table, enthusiasts aren't facing a pretty future. If you want the considerable merits of a naturally aspirated engine, better buy a 2014 or 2015. The future is going to be small displacement turbos, perhaps hauling batteries around to game the EPA treadmill test. None of it bodes well for cost, reliability, or simplicity.

[en.wikipedia.org]

Note the 2012 Prius doesn't comply:

[en.wikipedia.org]

I'd have to get the Driving Ambition book out for an exact quote, but to paraphrase Gordon Murray on the McLaren F1, he wanted no isolators from the driver, ah, here's Wikipedia's entry:

Gordon Murray insisted that the engine for this car be
naturally aspirated to increase reliability and driver
control. Turbochargers and superchargers increase power
but they increase complexity and can decrease
reliability as well as introducing an additional aspect
of latency and loss of feedback. The ability of the
driver to maintain maximum control of the engine is thus
decreased.

So my preferences are in good company with one of the best designers ever.

Jim