Dealer experience; and crack cause conjectures.

Hi Folks,

My MY2000 boxster S ( track/street car) has a cracked windshield for the second time, this one less than 6 months after the first.

When i went through my Insurance Company's subcontractor it was a nightmare and int he end they could not do the work.
I wound up having a Porsche shop do it (insurance paid)

I have two questions really:

1. is there a cheaper way that you have had luck with? e.g.: safelite? Were you satisfied?
2. Is there something more durable that you have experience with?

TIA

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Safelite replaced the windshield in my Boxster some years ago and the replacement has been fine. OEM glass was used. That was then. Not sure now if that's still the case. The replacement was done through my insurance and it would not pay the cost (~$1300 at the time) of having this done at the dealer. I found out most dealers use Safelite or a local installer for their glass work anyhow.

The replacement job was done at my office parking lot. I made sure the car was clean and dry. Before the tech started we examined the new glass and we satisfied ourselves it was identical to the glass in the car, with the same tinting and antenna traces, etc.

Afterwards the tech told me to take it easy for a while (24 hours?) And I did. I avoided any hotrodding the car and I avoided entering/leaving driveways that put a twist on the car.

The job appears to have held up well with no problems I can see. The replacement glass is just as soft, or hard? -- as the OE glass in that it is getting badly pitted. There are some small rock chips but nothing bad enough to force me to have it replaced.

It is or was at any rate back when I needed new glass Safelite. It may be a different company where you are.. But most likely the dealers rely upon some glass shop for their glass work.

If you can find out who the Porsche/BMW/M-B dealers use in your area and use that shop, probably that guy, I'd recommend you do that. Trouble is dealers do not, did not at least when I called around, seem to ready to share that info. But over the years I have spotted Safelite on the lots at various dealers. The dealer has a regularly scheduled visit for the guy to come out and repair or replaced broken glass. He may not be there every week though if the dealer doesn't have anything for him to do.

If you can speak with a tech and find out what other things besides the glass should be replaced along with the glass. In my car's case a new rubber seal/gasket was used. 'course, the old one didn't survive the removal of the old glass. BTW, if you can miss this stage I recommend it. Not pretty seeing holes punched in the glass in order to lift the old glass out of the car.

Due to pitting, I had my 986's windshield replaced on-site at my at-the-time dealership, which brought in one of the big outfits. (On my own dime: I'm not the type to try to cheat with insurance.) The job was mostly ok, but there was a little bit of gasket sticking out somewhere along the inside, which they adjusted. I guess it depends on which person actually does the job. I went through the dealership because I figure whoever does the job will be familiar with the brand. (Right now I'm working on scheduling having the clear films replaced on the front hood and apron; going through the dealer, for the same reason.)

So, as to the windshield: If it wasn't an airborne object impact, consider the stresses/chassis flexing that occurs in track driving. Does the car have an added front cross brace? If it doesn't, maybe that would help. If it does, maybe the thing is transmitting a force into the windshield frame in a way that the frame wasn't designed for.

In my Boxster's case a rock hit the glass and a crack developed that grew pretty rapidly until it spanned the entire width of the glass. At the end the view out was like looking at a Picasso landscape painting. I turned this in to the insurance company and I had to pay the deductible which was $500.

Currently both windshields have rock chips several per windshield and both are getting pretty heavily pitted. Barring another rock hit and crack when the time comes I'll just have the glass replaced probably at the dealer where I have the cars serviced. I will probably get a discount but it will be expensive nonetheless. Nothing I can do about it. After enough miles the glass just gets pitted and rocks hit the car and the glass once in a while and these impacts take their toll on the glass and paint if they miss the glass and hit paint.

When I bought my 02 S in 2003, between the time we negotiated price and delivery of the car, the previous owner got 3 small rock chips in the windshield. At the time, I talked to a local dealer who put me in touch with the independent installer that they used so that I could find out what the cost would be to replace it so that I could adjust the purchase price. The installer told me at the time that the only glass available was OEM. He also told me that he would cut the price by $300 (I think) if we bypassed the insurance company. S glass was more expensive than Base Boxster glass because of the titanium strip around the windshield.

BTW, I never replaced the windshield. The rock chips were small and in the lower left of the windshield, and over the course of 10 years, they never grew into a significant problem.

I've used Safelite to replace two Porsche windshields. Their work was fine, and since I have GEICO, it was done with no deductible. I did confirm on this site that the last replacement was definitely OEM.

I called both the Porsche specialist who did my windshield last time, and the local dealer where i know the service manager through PCA ( and the Gym).

Both told me who they used, even though i offered them the job. The Porsche specialist's glass guy is NJ-approved and therefore requires no haggling. I do pay the deductible, but mine is low.

I'm told that there are really only two level of glass - aftermarket and "premium" with true OEM being one of the two big premium suppliers - probably PPG and the UK company that i forget the name of.

I have an appointment for it to be done in my driveway by that familiy-owned firm when i get back from business travel.

I'm getting tired of replacing windshields

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Grant, from my experience, the most important thing is the skill, knowledge, and conscientiousness of the installer.

I've had them mess up stuff like my navigation antenna, my rain sensor windshield wiper system, and they even managed to trigger an SRS light. Eventually, I got it straightened out, but what a hassle. If you have ANY electronics hooked up to, or near, your windshield, make sure they are aware of them, and know what they are doing.

… because they got hit with a rock or other debris or on its own.
If the latter then your car's body may be flexing too much at the track.
Make sure they center it perfectly so that the glass has the same clearance all the way around.
Happy Boxstering,
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 311,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]
PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)

---

Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

... from 4 sources: 1) A porsche race shop, 2) the installer, 3) the dealer service manager and 4) a regular good shop:

a) if installed properly, the glass floats in a silicone like surround. Debris or rust can cause stress cracks - but it should not be an issue
(note, mine has a small, but real, rock hit along the crack, so it was hit)
b) It must be cleaned. The silicone surround must be flat. They guy who did mine is supposedly - by several sources - excellent
c) The glass in these cars is fragile - they are seeing LOTS of failures. I expect rocks hitting at track speeds don't make it easier
(that said i do not recall any major rock hit - none caught my attention)

The funny thing is I hear lots of talk about better harder glass vs softer. In most materials hardness is a trade-off with tough-ness.
I need tough, maybe softer glass!

As noted, there is a telltale rock pit along the crack. So mine had an external cause. I cant promise it was not track-flexing, but the evidence is that its just debris.

I'll ask the guy when he comes to do the job.

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Floats on a silicone like surround...... not what I understand. Windshields are part of the structural rigidity of the car as I understand it to be.... that is why it is common for a chip to grow into a crack. If you track your car, it stands to reason they twisting forces increase the loads and thus increase cracking from chips. Further, when a P-dealer had to re-do my windshield, they were worried that the glass would have to be broken to get it out... or maybe they said it usually brakes when they remove it. The cements they use are not soft like silicone but much harder.

Again, this is my understanding.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

" it is not a stressed member, if you have debris that allows the surround to apply torque, it can easily result in a cracked windshield. The most common issue is rust or an improperly laid silicone surround"

And FYI this is a well known racing dealership who knows well how the car is used :-)

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2016 01:00PM by grant. (view changes)

I've had really bad experiences with Safelite.

1 - Cheap Chinese glass for these cars is now available and had been for some time. One time they used non-oem glass and I had them replace it in the 2000S. It may pass safety requirements but it distorted the field of view.
2 - Safelite said they would handle the insurance company....... then they called said I did NOT have OEM replacement coverage after they contacted my insurer.... they lied. I did. I suspect they filed for OEM and pocketed the delta.
3 - I have friends who have had similar stories with Safelite where they say OEM, the guy showed up without OEM, and my buddy sent them away.
4 - Son of the P dealer owner was new and working in service... wanted to use a "guy he knows", the older service guy was there telling him to use the installer they always used..... installer botched the job, didn't set the glass in deep enough and I got wind noise..... P dealer made good and replaced it one week later using their trusted guy.
5 - Safelite did non-OEM glass on my old Honda...... distorted the filed of vew as you looked left and right.... never never non-oem glass for me.

Short answer: use the P-dealer and demand OEM. Safelite lies. It is not worth it.

Good luck
Bruce in Philly