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What year? 250,000 miles is a lot - that's 400,000km, in approximately 9-11yrs?

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failure. Darn and I hoped to get 250K miles out of the original ones. Time to have the inner/outer CV boots renewed and of course the CV joints cleaned and repacked with fresh grease. Est.is $1K to do both sides, inner and outer.

Also, the report the driver's side camshaft cover is leaking. I do not know how bad. Est. to address this is $1150. Kind of high imho. I'm going to see how bad it is leaking before I have this done. But I gave go-ahead for the CV work.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
Just had mine done about a month ago on my 2001 base. Cost was about the same as your quote. I got 127,000 out of mine, so you did really good! I guess 127 ain't bad either.
CV boots have failed
JMstamford,ct - Tuesday, 26 April, 2011, at 7:57:04 am
It is probably easier and safer to replace the whole assembly.

Once the boots rip the crud enters. You would have to be a lucky man to have no damage to the cv joints. Typically the parts cost to replace the axles is more than compensated by the labor savings.
Re: CV boots have failed
Capt Ron - Tuesday, 26 April, 2011, at 10:47:26 am
It's about 50/50 that they'll call back after they get the old boots off.
The inner CV joint can be rebuilt.

Local autoparts store has OEM (GKN) boot kits at $20 for boots, clamps, grease and inner shield.

Inner CV joint is $120-150 for a new one, with boots etc.

The passenger side inner one has a small tear in it. Car has 87,000km (55,000miles). Doing it myself.

I have to look at the records, but my 01 BoxS had one ripped boot on independent PPI when I bought it (June 08). Went 50/50 labour with the stealership where I bought it. I think it was the driverside, but have to check my records for sure.
inner CV boot on driver's side has completely come apart at small end. Other boots have partial tears/cracks and even those that are still intact show signs of coming apart soon.

Tech is working on a price to remove/replace with new halfshafts vs. remove, clean/repack the bearings in the orignal ones. I'm leaning towards the former, just replace the original half shafts with new ones. New boots. New bearings.

Got a chance to look at the oil leak on the driver's side of the engine. The leak is not severe enough to wash dirt away, so the oil flow is very light, maybe more an oil seep rather than a true leak.

No oil is reaching the ground, nor making it to any other parts below the camshaft cover. Tech said I could let the leak go until the next oil change or even the one after. I didn't think to ask when I was there but I wonder if it is the camshaft cover or possibly a spark plug tube? I mean how does one know? Big difference in cost to put right of course depending upon which is the source of the oil leak.

New quote on the camshaft cover R&R to address the oil leak has it under $1K and then there's some extra discount perhaps.

Might ask tech to clean the camshaft cover and let me drive the car and after some miles put the car on the lift again and see where the leak's coming from to confirm it is a camshaft cover and not a spark plug tube.

Just to put some perspective on the situation I stopped at the Pleasanton MINI dealer last night after work. Checking out new MINIs. Looked at a JCW (cab though so no way) and a couple of S models.

Dealer has plenty, and I mean plenty of stock, Ss and base MINIs. Zero point nine interest too -- at least 'til the end of the month -- so I can leave my money in the bank.

But still I think paying say $2K to fix the Boxster is cheaper than trading it in and buying a new MINI, even an S, at around $25K not including tax/license/etc. Sure are alot of MINIs to choose from though...New car lot was full and salesman told me the dealer had even more stock stored on two nearby but 'hidden' storage lots.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
Mini's are a unique enough car I notice them and I've noticed them turning up on the used car lots in town in the last few months. Guess they are no longer the "in" thing.
a change from a few years ago when I visited this same MINI dealer and every sales person was at a desk writing up another sale. The only reason one would get out of a chair would to be hand the demo keys to the next person who showed up for their demo drive appointment.

I'm becoming torn regarding the Boxster. Can't help but think every time the Boxster goes into the shop now is the time to replace it.

My Boxster has been a great car, and still is a great car. Even with its high miles I'm amazed at how well it runs, how good the car still feels.

But I can't help but wonder how many more times I can spend thousands of dollars fixing the car. After this latest repair the car's cost me nearly $5K in repairs since the 1st of the year and there's still the worn out converter on the passenger side and of course the car's on its original clutch which might last a long time but might need replacing next week. Even if the clutch lasts forever , there is the starter, alternator, A/C compressor, power steering pump, steering rack, radiators, and A/C condensors, that are all orignal. The 3rd AOS is getting close to its replace by date, too.

I looked up the car's trade-in value today on www.kbb.com it ranges from a high of $5725 to a low of $4050. I'm sorely tempted to move the Boxster on and buy a MINI S. One minute I'm going to do it, the next minute I'm not.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
Always a tough call
mikefocke, '01S Sanford, NC - Tuesday, 26 April, 2011, at 5:12:19 pm
How much to pour into repairs, when to call it quits. But figure the depreciation on a new mini versus on your car that you still enjoy and the calculations may change. I believe in pulling the trigger when circumstances change or it stops being fun. I'm about at the age 68) where that change in circumstances will kick in and, if selling mine were easy, I'd probably do it. But the only maintenance or repair dollars I put into mine in the last year are a set of tires. Not another dime. So maintenance costs aren't a factor for my car (60k miles).
Do your research. I've known some people with Minis who got rid of them due to reliability. They loved the cars, but it was getting to be too annoying. Mini may have addressed these issues as the years passed, or it may not have been a systemic issue and just a random thing with what I've heard. They are basically BMWs, so repairs are probably in the same class in terms of costs to repair.
America (IIRC)) and it was super-charged.

This engine was replaced by one developed in partnership by PSA Peugot Citro├źn and BMW. This new engine is turbo-charged and has some other nice/interesting features, for instance: variable engine oil pump similar to the variable engine oil pump used in the new Porsche DFI engines; that has proved to be a better engine, more economical too, than the original Chrysler engine.

The Chrysler engine wasn't a bad engine. I seriously considered buying a MINI back when they had this engine. I had satisfied myself the car/engine was worth buying but demand kept the prices high and I was not able to make a deal for a car. I ended buying a new 2006 GTO for about what I would have paid for a MINI S.

Anyhow, the engine wasn't bad just a bit outdated. The supercharging while helping the 1.6l engine deliver impressive performance (and rather reliably to IIRC) negatively impacted fuel economy. Takes HP to spin that supercharger and of course this is paid for by increased fuel consumption. A rough rule of thumb is a supercharger makes an engine perform/behave like an engine 1.5 times the supercharged engine's displacement, thus a 1.6l supercharged engine would run/perform (and burn gas) like it had 2.4l of displacement. But of course people would compare the supercharged 1.6l engine to other NA 1.6l engines instead of 2.4l engines and the fuel consumption numbers were not kind to the supercharged engine.

Anyhow, I'm just thinking, not yet acting. I gave the go-ahead to clean/repack the original halfshaft CV joints vs. replacing the half-shafts with new ones. I got the estimate for the new halfshafts. You better sit down: The cost is just a few dollars over $900. Each. Factor in labor and such the halfshaft R&R using new halfshafts would run over $2.2K. The clean/repack method cuts this cost to under half as much. Still not cheap but the car needs the halfshafts to work and I need the car to work. Otherwise the car is of no value to me.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
- it would take a special person to want to own a car like that.

- I would assume, one who does their own repairs, looks for used parts, and rarely sees the Pcar Service desk.

Question: Does the service advisor at the dealership give you a high-five when you walk in?

My 1st car was a 1995 Acura Integra. I put close to 300,000km on it (around 185,000miles) in 7 yrs. But I was single for most of that time, and my girlfriend and work were 25 miles away, and I thought that was fairly high mileage back then.... about 40,000km/25,000miles per year.

Pete
Free Advice and Worth Every Penny
paulwdenton - Thursday, 28 April, 2011, at 6:58:17 am
It seems crazy to keep pouring money into your old car that you'll never get back. Not only that, but it seems likely that getting the repairs done is taking time that could be better spent on other pursuits, such as actually driving the car. If it was me, I'd definitely sell. However, I don't think I'd suggest a Mini Cooper. They are cute and all, but they don't enjoy a very good reliability reputation. Considering how much you like your Boxster, why not just buy another used one, but one that doesn't have 250K miles on it? Or, why not just drive that Turbo that you have? Driving the Turbo would probably be the cheapest option you have because you'll be eliminating all maintenance, repairs, taxes, and insurance on the old Boxster altogether. Always cheaper to drive one car rather than two.
Re: Free Advice and Worth Every Penny
lacleven - Thursday, 28 April, 2011, at 9:26:16 am
ditto, buying another used boxster with less miles on it..
Cheaper to keep her
dghii - Thursday, 28 April, 2011, at 11:13:36 am
Your repair will cost the same as taxes and registration on a $30k new car.

I'll split the difference with you and give you $4900 for you car...

dghii 2000 Boxster S 6speed 112k miles
Quote
paulwdenton
It seems crazy to keep pouring money into your old car that you'll never get back. Not only that, but it seems likely that getting the repairs done is taking time that could be better spent on other pursuits, such as actually driving the car. If it was me, I'd definitely sell. However, I don't think I'd suggest a Mini Cooper. They are cute and all, but they don't enjoy a very good reliability reputation. Considering how much you like your Boxster, why not just buy another used one, but one that doesn't have 250K miles on it? Or, why not just drive that Turbo that you have? Driving the Turbo would probably be the cheapest option you have because you'll be eliminating all maintenance, repairs, taxes, and insurance on the old Boxster altogether. Always cheaper to drive one car rather than two.

Quick autotrader search turned up 7 2002 to 2004 Boxsters within 25 miles of my location. Priced from $21,991 (I'm telling you '991' is the new '999') to $14,888. Average price is $18,532. Sure these are asking prices, but still.

(Just revised the search and there are 320 listings for 2002 to 2004 Boxsters any distance from me. $30,990 is the highest price. $19K is the average. $6500 is the lowest.)

I can keep my Boxster on the road for a long time with what it would cost me to buy a comparable car though with fewer miles. Of the 7 cars within 25 miles of me the lowest priced car is an S with 82,645 miles. A base 2002 with 48K miles is listed at $17,971.

The problem with another used Boxster is there's no guarantee something major won't require attention shortly after I buy the car. This can range from an AOS to a clutch, to a water pump to a fuel pump, or even the dreaded you know what, to name a few.

Plus there's depreciation to consider.

Driving the Turbo is not cheap. Given the number of miles I drive its 20mpg (if I'm good) fuel economy means I'm filling up 2 sometimes more times per week. Gas is $3.459/gallon now in my area (or higher but I seek out the name brand stations with the lowest prices) so I'm spending close to $50/per fill up and $100/week on gas.

Last set of tires were Bridgestones, and they cost me $1700. These have over 12K miles on them and look to have I hope another 5K miles left to go.

Turbo brakes are close to needing doing. I can do that myself but it will still cost maybe $500 in parts per axle. (Rotors, pads, and necessary new hardware.)

Another thing causing me to lean towards keeping a 2nd car is the Turbo has not been as reliable as I thought it would be. Oh, the odometer just rolled over 60,000 miles today. The Turbo has since I bought it in June of 2009 has been in the shop now for idler bearing, leaking transmission (replaced), failed radiator fan/motor and radiator (dented from fan/motor failure), bad clutch accumulator and clutch slave cylinder, shifter linkage broke. Sometimes it takes a couple of weeks before the car gets back on the road. The tranny replacement took forever to arrive from Germany. The shifter problem took several days to fit in and get parts and get the car fixed. Given where I live and where I work I can't be without a car so if I didn't own a 2nd car I'd be on a first name basis with the local rental car agency.

I could possibly decide to get rid of both cars and get a new Cayman (not even an S, just the base). I've been toying with this even looking at a few cars. But I do like the Turbo. And if I trade it in I take a big depreciation hit. Private selling is a lot of trouble and not one I think I want to go through with the Turbo.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
Maybe more of a hassle, but cheaper for sure.

Grant
Well, I guess Boxster prices are a lot higher in California than in the rest of the country. There are dozens under $12K nationwide. If, e.g., you were to search in the Dallas area, you could find a couple with less miles than those you mentioned, and with asking prices under $12,000.

Your arguments for not selling the Box and just driving the Turbo don't convince me. Your expense for tires and brakes are going to be there no matter what car you drive. Repairs for the Turbo are high, but it's also a much newer car and overall really ought to average out the same or less than constantly repairing a Box with 250K miles. Therefore it really it comes down to gas, insurance, and taxes. If you get 20 mpg in the Turbo vs. 23 in the Box, with gas at $3.50 a gallon, that is an extra $500 a year. IMHO that's not that much. I figure your insurance savings from selling off the Box will at least be a wash for the extra gas cost for the Turbo. Also, selling off the Box will net you an immediate $5000 (that pays a lot of repairs and tires on the Turbo) and cut your taxes as well. It's definitely cheaper to sell the Box and just drive the Turbo. I just think you are making an emotional decision because you've had the Box for so long and you just love it ... not that there's anything wrong with an emotional decision, just don't try to rationalize it.
Quote
paulwdenton
Well, I guess Boxster prices are a lot higher in California than in the rest of the country. There are dozens under $12K nationwide. If, e.g., you were to search in the Dallas area, you could find a couple with less miles than those you mentioned, and with asking prices under $12,000.

Your arguments for not selling the Box and just driving the Turbo don't convince me. Your expense for tires and brakes are going to be there no matter what car you drive. Repairs for the Turbo are high, but it's also a much newer car and overall really ought to average out the same or less than constantly repairing a Box with 250K miles. Therefore it really it comes down to gas, insurance, and taxes. If you get 20 mpg in the Turbo vs. 23 in the Box, with gas at $3.50 a gallon, that is an extra $500 a year. IMHO that's not that much. I figure your insurance savings from selling off the Box will at least be a wash for the extra gas cost for the Turbo. Also, selling off the Box will net you an immediate $5000 (that pays a lot of repairs and tires on the Turbo) and cut your taxes as well. It's definitely cheaper to sell the Box and just drive the Turbo. I just think you are making an emotional decision because you've had the Box for so long and you just love it ... not that there's anything wrong with an emotional decision, just don't try to rationalize it.

instead of sharing my driving between the 2 cars.

Since I bought the Turbo in June of 2009 I've put on average 26K miles a year on the car, and I'm not sure what the Boxster has averaged recently but over the 9 years I've owned it it has averaged 26K miles per year. Anyhow, assuming with just one car I keep the mileage to 30K miles per year, at $4.439/gallon (just filled up the Turbo today at lunch: 12.762 gallons for $56.14, with the car delivering 19.3mpg over a distance of 249 miles) the added fuel cost is $1031. Sure, gas prices might come down to $3.50/gallon but I bet H*ll freezes over first.

Granted there is some psyhcology involved as well. With the Boxster I can get by with one fillup per week. It has a range of 300 miles before I need to fill up the tank. but driving the Turbo 100% of the time would have me filling up the car several times a week. Not only am I spending more money for gas I'm doing it more often and it just sort of bothers me. (And I am trying to cut back on my driving, but I can't bring myself to fly instead of drive.)

Based on what the Turbo has been like I'm not sure that even with fewer miles on it it is going to be a problem free as the Boxster was with the same miles. Essentially, I
drove the Boxster almost 80K miles with it needing nothing beyond regular servicing, tires, and IIRC a set of brake pads.

So far, the Turbo has had more reasons to be in the shop at 60K miles than the Boxster had a 60K miles. The only bright spot is the Turbo's ills have been covered by the CPO warranty.

The Boxster costs me less to insure than the Turbo but if I go to one car the Turbo costs me more than it does now to insure. Not as much as the Boxster, but insurance costs go up. The Boxster costs me $180/year to register vs. the Turbo's $560/year, though this will drop every year. Tire life on the Boxster is better, 20K vs. 15K and tires are cheaper, 17" vs. 18".

If I sold the Boxster there would be as you correctly pointed out an influx of cash from selling the Boxster. I might get $5K for it or even a bit more. I won't know until I sell it.

But the car needs some work before I could sell it. A converter is weak and a seller in CA is responsible for the car passing smog testing so I would have to spend $1000 (or more) to have the converter replaced, though I might gamble on fitting a converter from a salvage yard which cuts that $1000 to less than $500 if I guesstimate the cost of a salvage converter closely.

And lastly I might be more attached to the Boxster than I think. It has been a great car. I was at the dealer today checking on its progress and I mentioned that I had planned on having the CV boots renewed when I had the clutch replaced but the clutch has lasted 241K miles, that is the car is on its original clutch. One tech expressed considerable surprise and said that's darn good life from a clutch. No argument from me: And I added that while a lot of people knock the Boxster it has for me been a superb car and the reason I am now on my 3rd Porsche instead of switching to another brand.

Guess I miss the car more than I think. It won't be done until next week. The shop's got some higher priority jobs in -- mainly prepping new/used cars (sales are picking up!) -- and because I didn't raise a big stink about the shop taking longer than the estimated time the SM said he'd see what he could do for me to help reduce the cost of the repair. That's always appreciated!

Anyhow, I guess I took a lot of word to come to this: Once I get the car back and start driving it again, I think all of my talk about getting rid of it will die down.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
takes about $800-$1400 annually to keep it on the road. That's my experience, but interestingly, it matches the figures "The Car Doctor" uses on WWOR radio ($122/yr - 100/mo).

Since you have maintained your car and know its condition, i would avoid trading the angel you know for the (younger) devil you don't. Most people don't maintain cars like you do.

there are several parts you need to think about: cats; suspension bushings; shocks; anything rubber in fact.

We'll ignore the semi-random ones, such as AOSs.

Grant
I guess we are fortunate here in Philly as the shop foreman at the local dealer opened his own shop. He has well over 25 years of Porsche experience and while he is not cheap, he is definitely cheaper than the dealer. He also cuts me breaks on parts... for example, a cabin air filter costs me around $75 at a dealer, I think he charged me less than half that as the markup was outrageous. He said to me "I just can't charge that for that part." Pretty good guy eh? He also knows the non-Porsche labeled equivalents for things like shocks etc.

I have been very happy with his work and the pricing. Plus it is is fun to visit his shop as it is full of candy. Last time in, he had an amazing 356, three Lotuses of different vintages (one of his mechanics is a Lotus expert and owner), a Ferrari, a vette, two Ducatis..., a few track prepped Porsches, and more.

Anyway, and Indy can save you money in more ways than just a reduced labor rate.
self service with labor imputed.

Grant
Re: Why not find a good independant? I did.
AndyInNYC - Thursday, 5 May, 2011, at 7:03:25 am
Bruce,

Who's your guy in Philly and where is he located. I'm near enough that if he's good enough I'll bring my car to him.

Andrew
A great source of experienced, dedicated indoes is PCA
grant - Thursday, 5 May, 2011, at 8:45:23 am
Our region has tech sessions at a bunch of indies all the time - many of these people are the same ones fielding the questions in Panarama, etc. PCA is a great org that way.

Grant
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