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Could work out well if it is a turbo
Red_Lightnin! - Thursday, 2 December, 2010, at 10:09:20 am
IIRC - that is the layout the WRX uses. Would result in more power and less weight. More importantly, as the Fed Gov't ratchets up the emissions, safety and fuel economy requirements, it's gonna be hard to deliver the power to weight ratio necessary for Porsche performance with a normally aspirated motor.

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger
There's no replacement for...
Pedro (Odessa, FL) - Thursday, 2 December, 2010, at 10:33:39 am
... displacement winking smiley
Happy Boxstering,
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 299,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]

PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)



Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

Well said, Pedro
Red_Lightnin! - Thursday, 2 December, 2010, at 11:50:07 am
But given modern regulatory realities, I think it is going to be harder to get the performance we want, stay street legal, and do it with traditional NA motors. My understanding is that the reason our Boxsters are water-cooled was because of modern emissions and noise regulations.

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger
Re: There's no replacement for...
Wayne K - Thursday, 2 December, 2010, at 4:30:34 pm
The best part is that if a person has to go to the carpet to get the performance they want out of the smaller engines then there goes the fuel savings. How many people do you know that buy a sporty car and drive it to get the best fuel economy? I say buy the highest HP fuel powered car today that you will be happy owning for a long time because you may not be able to find another like it 10-15 years from now (new that is).
output. Most passenger vehicles spend the majority of their time operating at 30% of load or less.

A smaller engine is lighter, has less internal friction, requires less oil, has a smaller footprint, requires a lighter structure to hold the engine in place and so on.

There are huge benefits to a smaller engine that make all automakers moving to smaller engines a given over time.

The V8 is dead. The V6 will be the new V8. And the 4 (in various configurations though mostly straight or inline) will become commonplace.

New and stricter fuel economy requirements here and abroad and the EU's war on CO2 and soon to be the USA's war too barring a sudden infusion of common sense are driving this changeover.

Sincerely,

MarcW.
Read Road and Track Car of the Year Issue Jan 2011 articles on the M3 and the downsizing and turbofication of their engines. They aren't going for displacement.

As I read the issue it seemed almost all the cars reviewed or previewed were smaller displacement than their prior generation. (Excluding the F-car and the B-car that does 268MPH!)

Buick Regal...only 2 4 cyl engines available for example.

"Most significant American car in 40 years" ...1.6L. Takes premium fuel though.
Unless you drive a 918 *NM*
Boxsterra - Thursday, 2 December, 2010, at 9:20:36 pm
But the 918 displaces ...
Pedro (Odessa, FL) - Friday, 3 December, 2010, at 8:24:46 am
... a lot of electrons (twin electric motors) plus it still has a V8! winking smiley
Happy Boxstering,
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 299,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]

PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)



Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

It's amazing what $500,000 buys! *NM*
Red_Lightnin! - Friday, 3 December, 2010, at 12:57:15 pm
1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger
i've heard it's going to be even more than that. *NM*
frogster - Friday, 3 December, 2010, at 3:44:37 pm
--
MY 2000 S, Ocean Blue, Metropol Blue, Savanah Beige.
Bought June 2000 - Sold May 2010
I guess I'll have to buy mine used . . . *NM*
Red_Lightnin! - Friday, 3 December, 2010, at 4:00:59 pm
1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger
The Honda S2000 was a four cylinder and it never lived up to expectations in its short life. Everybody ravved about the upper end of the RPM range, but reality set in when buyers realised that you just don't drive like that on a regular basis. With Turbos, to me, blowing a lower displacement engine doesn't cut it. You always feel like you have to step on the gas to get anywhere and that grows old very quickly. Again, nobody drives like that all the time.

Now the Lotus is a four banger, but it is a niche car at best and weighs half as much as a Boxster. All reviews kill it on practicality--too small, too harsh, not comfortable, no conviences, etc. Definately not what you want from a car you are hoping will get you over the 150,000 production totals VW is eyeing for the Porsche brand.

The Miata is no sports car. It's a roadster. It's success is due to pricing and reliability. Neither of which equates to Porsche. And, reliablilty was always a big ding against the roadsters. It was a love/hate relationship with owners. Yes, Porsche does get good reliability ratings from JD Powers, but the annual servicing costs and out-of-warranty costs are not for the faint of heart. In 12 years of Porsche ownership (three different cars), myy wife has complained every time I've brought one in for a annual physical. Besides, the Boxster/Cayman really isn't in the Miata segment. Only thing in common is the two seater and ragtop (for the Boxster anyway).

I'm wondering how well received the six cylinder M3 with Turbo Charge will be received by the purist/enthusiast crowd who are loyal to BMW. After decades of 8 pistons, it could come down to size does indeed matter when emptying a bank account to buy a car.

Leave the flat four for the Baby Boxster.
Probably true, but I think the challenge for all these cars now are the laws. With the Feds pushing for mandatory 40MPG+, I just can't see having normally aspirated performance without a Lotus Elise type format, unless of course they make a pickup truck version of the Boxster and slip it through the SUV loopholes - "El Boxstero"

I think your point about the M3 is interesting, but remember that the first three M3 series were a straight six and when they went to a V8 the BMW purists yakked all over it, but they still sold plenty. There were plenty of people who predicted that no-one would buy a water-cooled Porsche either.

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger
1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger
Some of the most coveted M3s are actually the original series the M30s which were naturally aspirated 4-cylinders.

"The E30 BMW M3 was fitted with a high-revving 4-cylinder engine (BMW S14) which produced 175 kW (238 PS; 235 hp) in its final European-only iteration." -Wikipedia



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/03/2010 04:10PM by EJ in SC. (view changes)
Ehh...don't underestimate that Miata. It can't keep up with a Porsche, but it's every bit as fun.
JB/NOVA,
1997 986 - Wolfi,
Arlington & Middleburg, VA ,
Vir Quisque Vir
Some interesting quotes from PCNA
mikefocke, '01S Sanford, NC - Sunday, 5 December, 2010, at 9:59:05 am
http://www.ajc.com/business/porsche-challenged-in-poor-766718.html

Perhaps the most interesting in light of the smaller SUV and smaller 914-like roadster rumors was "Von Platen, PCNA’s president, says ... without offering a cheaper entry-level model like Mercedes and BMW.".
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