Those are TOE links, not drop links...

e.g.: Tarret engineering.

I know these are are great when you need a range of adjust-ability that exceeds that provided by the factory eccentric bolt.

I'm less confident that there is an inherent superiority in stability if the car can be aligned as desired with the factory part.

Is there that much play in the factory rear toe link?

Any BTDT? I do have the tarret in my "red" car, and it feels great, but that was changed at the same time the ROW030 and the pedrobrace went in, so i have more variables than equations. And they are not exactly free!

Context is my "will some day be my track car" which will have new control arms (not solid bushings); PSS9s; factory S sway bars, new sway bar bushings, and new mounts/bearings in the strut assemblies.

Front adjustable control arms for more negative camber will occur later since i'm en route to about -1.0 deg without them (Front).

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

I have the Tarett rear adjustable toe links as well as the Tarett eccentric bolt replacement (the latter I installed myself as it's trivial to do). I think that if you aren't adjusting, have the range of adjustment you desire, and don't have eccentric movement, then obviously these are of no value. But for a race car...

What I was told is:

- The eccentric bolt replacement does away with all movement of the eccentric bolt. The replacement is a fixed non-adjustable bolt/plate. No toe adjustment possible any more there, so....
- The adjustable toe links make adjusting the toe much simpler and direct and accurate than the eccentric. It seems like people say the eccentric moves or something. Or has to be loosened (or moves) for something which makes maintaining alignment difficult during some other work. I don't recall what the real issue is with the eccentric bolt. Maybe range also.

When installing the "correct" stiffer springs for Spec Boxster, we found that my 140K mile rear shock tower bushings were exhibiting cracks (in the rubber, looked similar to a worn front motor mount bushing) so we got new ones. Worth examining closely if you have the rear suspension apart since it's work to get in there.

The strut/shock assemblies should be cleaned and wiped while you have them out of the car. Lots of grit on the contact surfaces accumulates and it feels nice to easily spin things that make contact and not hear grinding.

I have the car aligned and its just where I/we want it with the OEM hardware. I am planning to put in PSS9s along with (as you suggest):

1. strut mounts with the rubber bonding , front and rear
2. the bearing rubber plate for the front
3. New lower rear control arms (200k and sloppy)
4. CV bootls (cracking but intact)
5. Sway bar bushings

The front control arms, bump stops, and a few other parts are "recent" (40-50k ago)

I'll have fairly recent bilstein HD shocks and new OEM springs if anyone wants them....

Now, on to what i am experiencing: Some vagueness, very slight wander, and an unstable feeling on-center or near-center at speed. As you go off center and build cornering loads it decreases (but some moevement remains). My presumption is that this is most likely the old, old rear control arm bushigns along with wear in the mounts/etc. I am hoping that it is not a rack or anything more permanent.

The reason i asked abotu teh tarret rear links is that i do have them on my other car, and it tracks like its on rails. But as noted it has lots of good, new stuff in it.

Sounds liek the rear links are "nice to have" but can be deferred until future, sicne the parts alone are around $500.

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

In one of my posts (re: the ball joint tool) i have the link.

But i have learned the following abotu the original toe lonks and the eccentric:

1. they have enough rubber to deflext. Issue? Minor but6 there.
2. The eccentric once set, can move when tightened.
3. They say the eccentric can move under load on the track. I never had that problem....who knows
4. there is very small range of adjustment, often insufficinet to keep zero toe as a car is lowered

in addition, there is another fault that the regular tarrets etc do NOT fix:

5. The height iof the connection point for the toe link differs from teh pivot point for the ball joint, so there is inherent bump steer.

tarret and redline sell (more expensive) solutons that include a drop link fromt eh hub mounting point to the ball, so that the toe link attachment poitn is effectively moved down to the proper position (tyypically about 5mm). Why Porsche did not do this is a mystery. Those cost more like $800 (tarret) and $600 (Rennline, unknown)

For now i am not solving that problem, i believe. It is not on my red car and it drives superbly, given its overall street-track balance.

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Good to know and all makes sense about the eccentric in the rear but I'm staying with "if it ain't broke don't fix it." When I did the CV boots I put the settings back using pencil marks on the eccentric and then took it for a real alignment. The dealer shop almost didn't believe I had it apart since the settings were barely off. Like you, I have no handling complaints and the rear tire wear has been fine, both street and track. Dealer will be doing an alignment on Monday following installation of camber plates. Curious to see how far I can get on a non-lowered car. I have no interest in lowering so it will be what it will be.

With improper toe you will eat tires faster than you can order them.

I got the Rennline ones from Eagleday for $239 and it includes spacing so that you can adjust away bump steer.

[eagleday.stores.yahoo.net]

I juts got off the phone with Ira at Tarret who indicated that unless i lowered it a LOT i would probably get away with stock.
Are you saying "absolutely not"?

others?

The cost just keeps rising :-) Sigh.

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

Mine had no trouble with alignment for a while. After a few years it became impossible to get proper toe with the stock toe links.

I'm not saying it won't work with the stock links. I'm saying that it's close. That said, almost every alignment shop will redo the alignment if you have to install the toe links after they attempt it the first time. So unless you're pressed for time I wouldn't bother getting them yet.

Here is a picture of mine installed:

Now, back to your question, my row030 went in when i had the repairs from my track incident. I got the car back roughly Christmas. Cant say how many miles - 5 track days so far though!

It looks to me like you got the TOE LINKS with the bump steer correction. Do i see properly?

Worth the roughly 2 x money...?

I have the regular tarrets on my red car (with the 030s)

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

I am installing camber plates up front on my 2001S this week and leaving it stock otherwise (for now). Other than a PedroBrace, rear is and always has been factory. I take the approach that if you change too many things at the same time, you will never figure out what actually helped and what did not. For that reason (and $$ of course), I am taking the sequential approach. Lack of negative camber in front eats up track tires so that is coming first. The strut bearings looked fine so I added a little more grease and reinstalled them for now. I will go with uprated struts at some point but not this year unless something actually breaks, which is unlikely.

My rear tire wear is damn near perfect as-is so I am not inclined to spend money back there at this point. We will see going forward.

I am more interested in identifying the cause of some current behaviour (described in my two posts above) that bothers me.

I have also read that the factory toe link does not have sufficient travel if the car is lowered appreciably - whcih would make it mandatory. I have also read the reveerse.

Switching to 225/45-17 fronts also improves front wear dramatically.

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

I went to all same size on the track tires this year and it did help some. I still want a non-radical amount of negative camber to dial out understeer but don't want to make it twitchy on the street. Once I get the plates in I will have it aligned and see where we fall. For your vagueness problem, I would always look to the expendable rubber parts first as it appears you are. I don't know for certain but imagine that a problem with the rack would be noticeable under most conditions and not just those you describe. Best to do the easy, inexpensive stuff first anyway. Good luck with it. I took a look at my sway bar bushings and drop links and they appear to be in decent shape but I would expect that at 73K. If/when I move to new struts I will do them at that time just to do it. I am hoping that the camber in combination with bigger front tires will be enough improvement to keep me happy for the rest of this track season. RMS-IMS-clutch are on tap for the winter so that will be a big bill. It never ends once you get this track addiction but I have no plans to attempt rehab. : )