Re: Is this really what it sounds like when the IMS is going ? I found this video on you tube. See link

I make no conclusions nor do Do I wish to discuss this ad nauseum . I was at my local Indy ,and he had this stuff on the bench. I had my new torch with me so what the heck lets make a video. The guy in the video is my buddy mike , a local Indy. These four bearings are from cars that have passed through the shop. Mike recommends the bearing replacement if he is doing a RMS or clutch . It was kind of funny Mike asked if I had heard about the Internet sites that are frequented by irate BMW turbo owners . It seems they have some issues. Mike also commented on the sludge he is seeing in some models of cars . His exact word were "I'm seeing sludge and stuff you would see in the valve cover of a worn out taxi cab , and the cars oil monitor is not even saying its time for an oil change! " [www.youtube.com]

Thanks for taking the time to share.

It sure looks like there is no such thing as a "sealed" bearing in a Porsche IMS.

Regards, Maurice.

By most accounts, the factory-installed grease doesn't remain in the bearing indefinitely, which certainly reinforces the importance of regular oil changes with the 'right' oil. The second part of that seems a bit tougher to determine definitively. I've switched to Syntec 5W40 but recent posts would suggest 10W40 might be a better bet, even though it's not a Porsche-approved oil.

Interesting video.

Any idea of what year and mileages of the cars those bearings came out of?

Was the last bearing the MY2006 IMS design (Bigger bearing/larger shaft)? It looked a bit larger than the previous two, but it could have been the angle he held it.

I'm going in to see mike today ,I will ask if he knows about the mileage on the vehicles. I will also look at the third bearing again . One other observation was the black oil which poured from the second bearing did not smell good at all , mike had mentioned that the oil that came out of the ims tube smelled as well. He did not think the oil would ever drain from the bearing during winter storage as you have to drain the oil to do the job, and everyone he has done had loads of oil around the bearing area. Maybe the oil gets in that area and overheats from friction. I guess a bearing engineer would have insight on that subject. I would assume these cars were not super high miles cars as most Canadians store their cars. but I will ask.

The oil may be black from particles worn from the seal. If the oil smells burned, it could be from overheated seals. If the oil smells "fishy",(no pun intended), it could be from extreme pressure additives in the oil.

Something to think about. I believe that the oil level in the engine is at the IMS bearing when full. If the oil level is on the low limit, there may not be enough oil splashed on the seals to cool them. From my observations, the seal material is standard Buna N, which is good for a max temp. of about 250F. This material will get hard with time and temperature.

Ed B (Bearing Engineer)

So, based on watching this video, I take away three things:

1) Worth considering a bearing change when you do a clutch - I seem to remember the part is about $500 bucks, and labor not bad if the clutch is already out
2) Change oil early and often, use a good product and make sure it is properly filled - I will continue to stick with 5,000 mile oil changes and look askance at manuals and TSBs claiming oil changes at 10,000 - 12,000 miles
3) In my mind, this argues for frequent use of the car - letting the engine get warmed up to essentially "change" the oil in the bearing through use and keep it lubed after the "seal" goes

John

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger

(actually, thought i said all that when i posted my pics).

in fact i was at the point of intentionally revving the car out once warm a lot - its certainly fun medicine anyway. Its very interesting that very few tracked cars [appear to...] fail, and those that do are the ones that are driven at the track *but then stored*.

And once the flywheel is off - its right there. The only complicated part at all is securing the cams so they can't move relative to each other and/or the crank.

Grant

[www.youtube.com]

I checked with Mike the really bad bearing had 60000km on it the other two 120000 and 140000. I m am as tired of this as everyone else is . It is time to put it to bed , may I suggest we know as much as we need to know and a standard reply to any enquires would be great, How about it Marc W or Guenter you two write excellent articles how about a standard reply that we can defer to.

Just got a really great PM . I will let him post, and his work gets two big thumbs up from me. Perfect just Perfect . Good night subject enjoy a long slumber.

As i noted when i posted the pics mine had none of that apparent play and the races were fully intact. Despite that, there was NO, none zip grease. It was all splash lubricated with engine oil.

37k, frequent oil changes, always driven easy until warm, then driven hard. 17 DE days + similar AutoX.

Grant



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2011 07:22PM by grant. (view changes)

I replaced the engine on my '99. Both engines were factory remanufactured engines, so exact mileage is unknown. However, the engine coming out of my car had less than 64,000 miles, and the IMS had no play whatsoever. The IMS in the other engine had about as much play as the bad one in that video. That engine had less than 96,000 miles on it. FWIW.