My history goes back.....

VW, Audi and Porsche will all have versions of the 914-like roadster though they aren't all coming out at the same time or with the same engines. The VW version is said to be priced like a Miata.

Ouch--more competitors for the Miata from three German variants.

Sounds like a GM marketing plan--same basic platform sold through different brands, each with different twists to meet their respective markets-- for plebeian (VW) to upmarket (Audi) to sports car crowd (Porsche)


How big is the market for a sporty 2 seat roadster in the $25-30K range?

It seems like market saturation will arrive quickly with three new german models on the market in that price range. And the Miata is a tough car to beat from what I understand.

[www.inautonews.com]

They mention a starting price of 30K euro on the Porsche model and 25K euro for the Audi. With the current conversion at 1.45 euros to the dollar, that puts the Porsche version very close to the current base Boxster pricing.

Oops--should be $1.45 USD to the Euro, putting it at around $45K USD unless they come up with special (lower) pricing for the US market.

If you're looking at China, it could be pretty big, at least until the great implosion happens.

I have a feeling a lot of people will go for a roadster that's simpler and cheaper to own than a Boxster, but slightly larger and sturdier than a Miata. Maybe it's the niche left open by the departure of the S2000. My problem with the Miata is width (I would have to cut off the left arm to own one) and construction (If I had to be in an accident, I'd MUCH rather be in the Boxster). Mazda needs to do three things for the Miata to compete with these upcoming German offerings: 1) widen the cabin a little, 2) stuff a rotary under the hood, and 3) get the thing crash-rated (I haven't seen a rating since the 2005 model year). Alternatively, they could simply improve the looks of the RX-8 and cut the top off. I'd go for either one.

Quote
longislander1
I have a feeling a lot of people will go for a roadster that's simpler and cheaper to own than a Boxster, but slightly larger and sturdier than a Miata. Maybe it's the niche left open by the departure of the S2000. My problem with the Miata is width (I would have to cut off the left arm to own one) and construction (If I had to be in an accident, I'd MUCH rather be in the Boxster). Mazda needs to do three things for the Miata to compete with these upcoming German offerings: 1) widen the cabin a little, 2) stuff a rotary under the hood, and 3) get the thing crash-rated (I haven't seen a rating since the 2005 model year). Alternatively, they could simply improve the looks of the RX-8 and cut the top off. I'd go for either one.

My Own Edited Version of Your Post (With Apologies):
I have a feeling that a few people* will go for a roadster that's simpler and cheaper to own than a Boxster, but slightly larger and sturdier than a Miata. Maybe it's the tiny niche left open by the departure of the S2000.** My problem with the Miata is width (I would have to cut off the left arm to own one) and headroom (I would have to cut off my head to own one) and construction (If I had to be in an accident, I'd MUCH rather be in a 2005-present Boxster -- not applicable to the 1997-2004 Boxster which, in a rear-end collision, would result in my splitting my head open like a melon against the rollbar). Actually now that I think about it, the Miata is actually much safer than the 1997-2004 Boxster because I can't actually fit in the Miata and therefore can never be in an accident in one. Mazda needs to do three things for the Miata to compete with these upcoming German offerings: 1) widen the cabin a little, 2) increase the headroom, legroom, and raise the top of the windshield so it's not at eye level, 3) stuff a rotary under the hood, and 4) get the thing crash-rated (I haven't seen a rating since the 2005 model year). Of course, if they actually did these things, it wouldn't be a Miata any more, but what the heck. Alternatively, they could simply improve the looks of the RX-8, eliminate the two back doors, and cut the top off. I'd go for either one, except neither one is likely to happen.

* C'mon, a lot of people? How many people buy 2-seat roadsters at all?
** How many people ever bought S2000's? Not enough to justify a follow-up model. Just sayin'.

I have no argument with your edits, except that they don't apply to me. I don't own a pre-'05 Boxster (my head sits centered in the padded headrest ) and I do fit in the Miata, at least when it comes to headroom and the other dimensions beyond width. You could easily widen the Miata by a couple inches or so, stuff in a rotary, still preserve most of its attributes, give it a little more excitement and probably improve the front-to-rear weight balance and, thus, the handling. Except for length (largely due to the RX's front overhang), the current Miata isn't all that much different in dimensions vs. the first generation RX (157.3" long, 67.7" wide, 49" high, 2511 lbs for the Miata vs. 170.1", 65.7", 49.6" and 2290 for the RX). Mazda is planning a new rotary RX that, according to sketches, will definitely look better, but I don't believe it's a convertible. They keep trying to address the oil consumption and mileage issues, but I haven't heard what improvements are expected for the next generation. All I can say is that it was a phenomenal engine in my old RX and one reason why I kept that car for 11 years without incident.

I'm not an auto executive so I can't comment on your view re lack of customers for roadsters. While Honda is apparently out of the sports car business to focus on family-oriented vehicles, the marketers at VW-Porsche-Audi seem to disagree (not to mention Mercedes, BMW, Nissan, Mazda and maybe others that I'm missing at the moment). In fact, it looks like the VW will fill the exact niche I'm talking about.

going back to the 70s and owning some Toyo-Kogo stock. Loved the first RX-7 shapes but the engines were not so good and I see so many negative comments today I can't see the financial case for putting one in a car designed today with CAFE standards even if the 3 series helps offset. I see so few rotarys that I think the market has spoken. Sad because I lost money and so did my dad and I had great hopes based on the early hype.

I had the same space problem with the S2000 and the Miata and the same concern over the rollbar of the Boxster. I just lived with the seat forward and down and tested every position for head-bar impact potential. I was once hit from the rear and no head-bar collision. If my torso was taller, I couldn't have lived with the 986's design.

I have been racing an RX-7 as well as tracking the Boxster and lemme tell ya', those Wankels make great race motors. I can appreciate why street drivers complain about them (loud, smelly, smokey, limited longevity, and limited horsepower in a bloated emissions-compliant street car). But none of that stuff matters for a race car and with a power to weight ratio and effectively no redline, all I can say is - WOW!!!! - when the motor is running right I am basically passing other cars wholesale.

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger

The wankel engine might have had a future back in the early 70's when gas was $.33/gallon, but despite all the work Mazda has thrown at this motor over the years and the additions of modern engine management systems, it still provides lousy gas mileage--relatively speaking--and reliability on the the new motor in the RX8 has not been good.

Having owned an early RX8, I thought the basic design of the car was sound and was a fun car to drive, but the motor and transmission issues we encountered--more than any modern car we've owned in the past 30 years--made us peddle the car after three years.

to the RX2!

Bought into the wankle engine hype and got a Coupe - to say it handled poorly would be an understatement!

Ed

Ed from Long Island (Tampa)
05S Cobalt/Blue/Blue