Re: Just back from the body shop ... learned a ton about painting and more....

Just back from dropping my 2000 Boxster S at a shop for a front bumper replacement. What I learned was that different shops do very different work - quality and effort. That may seem obvious but it really is true.

A quick background story: The Lexus/Honda owned shop I took my wife's IS250 to last year did a gawd-awful job. They are a "high production" shop and just did a crappy job. Took over three months of taking it back and back etc etc. I am embarrassed to say they just wore me out. The lesson I learned is that just because the shop is owned by the local Lexus dealer doesn't mean they do good work. "Knowing" a Lexus is irrelevant - at least I thought the dealer-owned shop would have insights and care more. Further, my dopy friends (and me then) think that a Lexus-owned shop has better craftsmen etc. etc. and will do the best possible. Clearly they are just making assumptions based on the brand glow.

The high-end shop today gave me a tour and I was blown away at the effort they take to match paint. Matching is not only color, but also getting just the correct orange-peel that is already in the original paint. Further, this shop runs a paint match test on a sheet of metal. He showed me a white Lexus they were working on. They paint the sheet the base white, then progressively mask and paint multiple coats of clear while demasking. This way they can hold up the sheet to the existing paint and figure out how many coats of clear were on the original car. He told me you are never sure how many coats of clear are on a car as it may range from 2 to 5 coats depending on the line and day.

To match the car's original amount of orange peel, he said it starts with the craftsman (I can't say "painter" after this tour) assessing the existing peel on the panels adjacent to the new panel, then adjusting the flow, pressure, and distance to get the peel as correct as they can. Then they sand to match.

Also, the mix of mica colors (flakes) can vary. The mica is tinted and provides the flake and special sparkle in the paint. On the white Lexus, he shined some sort of bright white light on it and the paint lit up with violet! I never saw the violet in the paint as it just looked like a white, metal flake paint to me. So they run tests to get the mixture correct as the paint codes do not describe the large variability in the factory mixes. He uses the camera/computer that will tell him the mixes but he said it is not always correct and have to confirm and mix by hand.

Another interesting fact is that many of these newer cars, including the Lexus are having more trouble today matching panels and parts from the factory than before. They are actually going backwards in this respect. He said that bumpers and door handles are not even painted at the factory, but are covered in a colored film that is then baked to bond to the part. The rest of the car is painted and therefore there never is a perfect match anymore. He said he can now order colored parts from the factories but they never will match. So... he likes to paint them if he can and can get a better match than was original on the car. Again he showed me a new Lexus and clearly the bumpers and door handles didn't match (actually, I probably never would have noticed).

They also do Ferrari work as well as aluminum. He said they are one of the very few shops in the country that are "certified" for aluminum work. I don't know who or what "certifies" them but that is what he said.

Regarding Jaguars, he noted that Jaguar and Lexus use a large amount of industrial adhesives to attach the unit bodies and components. This gluing allows for a quieter car. I guess the glue joints don't transmit vibrations as well as welds. This however creates a real problem for body shops and requires a special set of skills if you want the car to be like new. Jaguar and Ferrari use heat treated aluminum that can not be bent and therefore must be replaced making repairs very expensive. He showed me a few Ferraris they were working on with one on a frame alignment jig. He noted that if the unit body is just slightly out of spec (bent) they tear the car down and replace the frame/unit body components. This becomes stupidly expensive.

The Ferraris have horrible replacement panels. He said the panels/bumpers/parts they send to him are "factory seconds" and simply do not fit. The one front, aluminum fender on the car cost $15,000 just for the part and didn't fit!!!! They had the fender on the car and was loaded with polish/sanding marks and had plastic body filler all around it. All this just to make it fit. He said they have to cut it, grind it.......etc. etc..... I joked and said it was Bondo but he didn't laugh, and corrected me that it was some type of special plastic material. Further, true to Ferrari tradition, the factory paint jobs are simply lousy. He showed me a model that was a few years old with runs in the paint!!! I kid you not! Runs!!!!! He said this was from the factory and is quite common.

So..... what does this all mean to me and you? Well, first make sure you find a good shop to do your work. Ask for a tour. They were happy to show off their skills. He noted they don't hire very often as their guys have been with them for 15-20 years. So is this job going to cost me? Actually they are meeting the insurance company quote. While I didn't ask specifically, I suspect they will put the same care into my bumper as they do the other stuff. I know that is an assumption, but I still feel pretty good taking my car here.

I hope there is some value to you reading this, at a minimum I was fascinated with this and am kicking myself for drinking the Lexus KoolAid. Any corrections clarifications, or additions are appreciated.

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger

After my recent experience with a quality body shop, I can attest that there really is a difference. My dad was a dealer and had his own body shop. His shop could not hold a candle to the work that top line shops (at least the one in Atlanta) do.

One on a white Lincoln with a gouged quarter panel I was preparing for an estate sale. Not truly white and the shop actually painted and then rejected their own work and repainted until it met their standards. I couldn't tell. They had a devil of a time because there was some rose in the paint hue and no amount of computer matching would get it right, it took trial and error.

The other was when I totaled my '99 but I got the explanation of what they do after I and my insurance company agreed that they would do the evaluation. I sneaked over several times just because they had such neat cars on their lot in varying stages of distress just to see the final results. Glorious.

Good shops have reputations for a reason.

Bruce what shop are you using?

The "good" shop is Karosserie: [www.karosserie.com]

I met the owner a few years ago and he told me how he got his start many years ago. Apparently he was asked by an acquaintance who worked for the American importer of Ferrari that American customers were rejecting their cars due to lousy paint and asked him to repaint them. I don't know how long ago that was (30 years ago?) but Ferrari hasn't improved the paint work by very much.

I always debate whether to post the names of places I had bad experiences with, but I did give these guys a "one star" on Yelp. Put it this way, they are on Rock Hill Road in Bala Cynwyd, PA and the word Martin is in their name.

(The shop that shall be unnamed.) When you first posted I looked up Karosserie. Now that's a shop!

Minus 40 degrees... Is that Fahrenheit or Celsius?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/19/2011 05:22PM by Laz. (view changes)

I had my Boxster center console painted body color by a local high end shop. Their quoted price was lower than the nationally advertised Porsche shop, and local shops that do exotics. The paint job was great, but there were a couple of glitches in reassembly involving lights and switches. After the second time, the owner loaned me his personal SUV for a day while they did it again, right this time. And he refunded the entire amount of the job.

My midnight blue center console looks beautiful.

Great report, Bruce, I learned a lot too. I'm from that area, and will use that company if the occassion arises.