Re: There's a safety reason to NOT use full-face helmets ...

Finally decided to do a DE thru my regional PCA. Need newbie advice. Lot's of questions, but a few are:

Tech inspection requires 50% brake pad thickness. 50% of what? I can't find OEM thickness anywhere?

Tire pressure - what works best on a stock setup (PS2's) Any different for Autocross setup? (trying that before the track days)

Helmets - need to buy one. Open face vs. full. I don't have any sources nearby to try them on so need to order online. Any recommendations?

Any other advice y'all can offer would be appreciated.

Current Love: 2008 RS60; 1st Love: 2001 base, triple black

No one will physically measure your brake thickness.
It's a visual measurement.
A new OEM front brake pad is about 1/2 in (13 mm) thick so 1/4 in (6 mm) or more is fine.
The rear pads are a bit thinner than the fronts.

I would highly recommend you also flush your brake/clutch hydraulics with new fluid.
This should be done every two years or before every DE event.

For tire pressure, if using street tires, start with the factory recommended cold tire pressures (32/36 psi).
After the first session you can adjust depending on how the car felt.
The pressures are going to go higher as the tire temperature rises.
If you look at the edge of the tire (where the sidewall meets the main tread) you will find wear markers.
These may be small triangles or arrow-heads spaced evenly around the edge.
What you want is for your tire to use the maximum tread possible so inspect after the first session and look where the wear is compared to the markers.
If the wear is short of the marker then drop the tire pressure a bit (1-2 psi). If you went over the markers increase tire pressure.

For helmet I personally use an open-faced one because of the heat.
They are not terribly expensive and will range between $150 - $400. There are many good brands such as Bell, Simpson, G-Force, Impact, etc.
It will need to have the 2010 Schnell certification in order to be approved for use.
Try by all means to physically try one one. Fit and comfort are essential in a helmet.
Once you know which one fits and feels good you can buy online. I use Discovery Parts dot com.

Because of the heat, make sure you stay well hydrated by drinking plenty of fluids.
When you're at the wheel, pay attention to your instructor but remember to have fun.

You can find a lot of additional useful information about tires, brakes, helmets, etc. on my website's Technical Articles:
[pedrosgarage.com]

Happy Porscheing
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 311,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]
PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)

---

Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

For the record i run Tech for NNJR-PCA (tech Steward)

1. Running as a newbie in green you wont abuse your brakes too badly. Rule of thumb is pad thicker than the backing plate. Truth is we (I) make adjustments based on the driver, the run group, the track etc. Should you have concerns, but a set of front pads and bring them to the track. Someone should be willing to help you change them on site if needed - i do it all the time. Be aware that the thinner brake pads get the faster they heat up and wear out - so the 2nd half of material is not the same as the first half.

2. Our rules, and the PCA national recommendations, require a brake fluid flush within 12 months of the event, not two years

3. Agree to start with roughly stock pressures, but measure them after your first session and speak with your instructor. In general dont allow any of them over 40 lbs hot. I try to end up with 34-35F / 36-37R hot on my 986 / 17" street tires.

4. I will chime in for a full face helmet for safety. When i started i bought a budget helmet for $235 and it worked great and had all the right certifications. Key is snell 2010, and it will be good until 10 years later (good through 2019).

Have a great time.

Grant

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/25/2013 09:11AM by grant. (view changes)

Different brands fit better on certain size heads. I had a Shoei in the distant past but have bought only Arai's for the last 15 years. Anything with the Snell rating is acceptable but buying without trying on is risky. Open vs. full face is a personal decision. I go full face because I also ride a motorcycle and like the option of using either helmet (I have an older one primarily for the bike and a 2010 for DE's). Full face is safer but also hotter, as Pedro points out. Not so much of an issue in your region and you will have more choices in a full face.

Most of all....have fun.

He did a DE with PCA Schattenbaum (NJ) and he said they required a full face helmet. True? I dunno.... but that is what he said.

Peace
Bruce

enforcement

OTOH the national tech chair is their tech guy - pete Tremper

Grant

gee-lenahan-at-gee-mail-dot-com

... with an airbag equipped car.
The airbag will deploy in such a way that it can catch the chin of the driver.
If using a full-face helmet it could snap the head backwards as the airbag expands.
Full -face helmets are safer when used with 5 or 6 point harness and no airbag in the steering wheel.
Just my $0.02.
YMMV.
Happy Porsche'ing,
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 311,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]
PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)

---

Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

If you do use a full face helmet, remove the face shield or close it. An air bag can/will drive it into your face/eyes if open.
You can buy full face helmets with cooling hose fittings. Running the A/C helps.

Most regions have loaner helmets, so you can try different ones.

In any case, buy a $10 helmet only if you have a $10 head.

Ed B

Quote
Ed B

In any case, buy a $10 helmet only if you have a $10 head.

Ed B

I think you nailed it, Ed

SNELL 2010 is usually required, but it is important to know what SNELL standard is required by your event organisor. Here the PCA DE requires an SA2010 and will not allow M2010. I'm no expert but I believe SA is for SPORT AUTO while M is for Motorcycle, having for difference that the SA standard require the interior fabric to be fire proof or more precisely fire retardant.

Just my 2 cents...

It used to be that way, but for SNELL 2010 the M or the SA is acceptable by PCA foe DE events.
The only one still not acceptable is the K (karting).
It's about crash testing against a roll bar.
Happy Boxstering
Pedro

Pedro Bonilla
1998 Boxster 986 - 311,000+ miles: [www.PedrosGarage.com]
PCA National Club Racing Scrutineer - PCA National HPDE Instructor - PCA Technical Committee (Boxster/Cayman)

---

Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar

"Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting" ... Steve McQueen as Michael Delaney in "LeMans"

"If you wait, all that happens is that you get older"... Mario Andretti

"Being second is to be the first of the ones who lose" ... Ayrton Senna

The key for a productive and fun day is to hope you get a good instructor for the hot laps. I have the tire pressure monitors in my 997S and ran street pressure. I drove the wheels off the car during the track time. My instructor was really encouraging me to hit my marks, set up cars and pass them. By the last session, I cut it short because the tires felt greezy. Looked at the TPM and the fronts were 55 psi (normally 37), if I recall correctly (maybe it was the rears). So, if you are really pushing your car, the tires may not cool off enough between sessions. If that's the case, you might want to talk with your instructor about dropping them a bit before going out the last time. Some people aren't out there to tear it up, it's more about learning the track, hitting marks, down shifting, breaking, etc. For them, pressure and heat really aren't an issue as they tend to start out pretty slow and maybe pick it up towards the end. Me, I knew I probably wouldn't be back on a track, so I wanted to tear it up from the start. In our PCA region, HPDE book up fast, so lots of cars vying for tack time, which is divided into groups. If your region isn't like that, then definately talk with your instructor about pressure due to longer runs.

Long way of saying, if you don't have the tire system on your car, think about bringing a pressure guage to check them and to discuss options with the instructor. Other factors come into play that he/she will know about at the track--sunny vs cloudy; air temp; track temp, etc., that can impact your tires on that particular day.

do a search for Porsche at the name of the track you will be doing the DE. The purpose is to see the way around the track with the proper lines. You need to know what's coming up next on the track. Also, helpful is to print out a track map. Your instructor will teach you where the turn in points are. Speed is not important in the green group; but knowing the track and turning in at the correct apex and tracking out on a consistant basis is very important.

Try not to over drive, you are driving a Porsche and want to have as much fun as possible. Speed will come with more seat time.

Per Pedro: If you look at the edge of the tire (where the sidewall meets the main tread) you will find wear markers.
These may be small triangles or arrow-heads spaced evenly around the edge.

I have use kids chalk sticks on three sides of each tire between the small triangles and the edge of the main tread to see what's going on with tire presures. Great also for autocrossing events.

BTW: A day on the track will cause permagrin. There is no none cure.

Oh, one other thing. Do NOT wash your car beforehand. I know we all like to have them shinny before a Porsche gathering/event, but your car will get so dirty, particularly if they do a wet skid pad session. Even if they don't, they'll just get dirty doing the various events--slalom, breaking, skid pad (wet and/or dry) and hot laps.

I've done HPDE twice with my PCA group (two different cars) and both times they had cones to mark the start of the braking zones and apexes (apexi?). Some tracks may have two or three different courses, so knowing which one they are using beforehad would be helpful if doing research ahead of time. My HPDE experience is that in the class room, they go over all of this, and then actually walk the track or part of the track before had. YMMV, however. Each region is probably different. Mine is extremely active track wise. Lots of really good, smart instructors who view the track as their home base. I recall the first turn at the Jefferson course at Summit Point coming out of the front stretch, you don't brake until real late into what looks like a right-angle, right turn. You brake at a point were you no longer see asphalt out the front windshield, just grass and trees. Pretty, freaky, even after several sessions ("start sliding to the left and head for that tree, now wait, wait, wait, brake").

You'll have a blast. The day just zooms by (pun intended).

Great idea, and I had already done that. It has really helped to visualize the turns and get familiar with the laps. You have to be careful though, and pay attention to the type of car. Some are smooth as silk, and others are squalking the tires at every turn. Think I'll go for smooth as silk, with an occasional squalk!

Current Love: 2008 RS60; 1st Love: 2001 base, triple black

Thanks everyone. All good advice. In addition to the two day DE, I am also doing my first autocross prior to the track time. Looks like I'm fine on pads, I still have way more thickness than the backing plate (only 17,000 street miles). I have routinely flushed brake fluid every 2 years and had it flushed today using the higher boiling point fluid. Also had new PS2's put on the rear today (yipee!)

Pedro, I appreciate the reminder about the tire wear triangles. I had read that before on your web page but will do a refresher.

The helmet choice is still perplexing. My regional pca tech rules require SA2012 rating. They recommend full face, but allow open face. I was leaning towards open face for coolnes (though less of a problem in Michigan than Florida), visibility and the ability to communicate to an instructor. Hadn't considered a potential full face conflict with air bags. Hmmm. Any issues with instructor communication with a full face?

I have the 19" tires so will start them at factory to begin with. I was just wondering if I should run the fronts a little higher than street setting?

I assume I will run using the "sport" suspension setting, but not sure about PSM. I was thinking to try PSM off for the autocross but probably best to leave PSM engaged for the DE. Sound OK?

Current Love: 2008 RS60; 1st Love: 2001 base, triple black

Quote
nmanitou (Doug in MI)
Finally decided to do a DE thru my regional PCA. Need newbie advice. Lot's of questions, but a few are:

Tech inspection requires 50% brake pad thickness. 50% of what? I can't find OEM thickness anywhere?

Tire pressure - what works best on a stock setup (PS2's) Any different for Autocross setup? (trying that before the track days)

Helmets - need to buy one. Open face vs. full. I don't have any sources nearby to try them on so need to order online. Any recommendations?

Any other advice y'all can offer would be appreciated.

Other advice:

Have fun, be safe and learn! It's such a slippery slope and very addictive.

Listen to your instructor: they're there to keep you and your car safe while learning how to drive on a race track!

I vote for full face helmets. I've seen too many intrusions into the car from deer, rabbits, and car parts to not have a full face cover. The instructor should have a comm system - the helmet type won't matter.

Getting the tires where you want the pressure is a personal thing, but the advice on keeping them below 40 HOT is a good starting point. Cold pressure is only a start - It's the hot temp that matters.

I have found the PCA DE folks to be friendly and helpful. If you have any problem, just ask for help.

Enjoy. and welcome to the madness!

Dave - 06 987 S coupe SG/NL; gone (but still my first love): 03 986 AS/GG/BK;