Re: It's all about the tires......X2

The NBC nightly news was showing the snow in Dallas re: the Superbowl. Somebody was out there driving their silver Boxster, or rather, sitting in their spun out Boxster. Not too good in the snow and ice?

one night with a couple of inches of snow on the ground. Also, managed to get around on unplowed/salted/gritted city streets just fine too.

But in another snow storm with some ice under the snow, on 71 highway (just northeast of Joplin MO), the Boxster got away from me on a banked curve. The car slid down the banking of the curve onto the shoulder. I managed to rock the car and get it going but it was touch and go for longer than I can care to remember.

Sincerely,

MarcW.

The Boxster is fantastic in snow and ice if properly equipped with winter tires. Have driven 3 Porsches in winter for 22 years without a problem.....and....driving reasonably for the conditions which many folks elect not to consider as they speed along like the roads are dry!!!! Bob

My Corvair, with the right tires and tire inflation, was great in slippery conditions. Volkswagens and early Porsches were good, too, if you paid attention. My worst car for slippery conditions was my '64 Pontiac GTO. All that power and bad weight distribution made for rubber in all four gears. I think it's a little ironic that Ralph got after the Corvair, when in my experience the GTO was much more squirrely.

Those wide summer tires on most Boxsters right now is not a good idea. The GTO is/was never good in anything but warm and dry conditions. But then people are nuts enough right now to be driving faster than conditions allow. Even here in my area we see spin outs on the road to Tahoe.

But a Boxster was on the national news, with someone driving it in the ice and snow, or at least trying to.

Why do most Americans think that all/4 wheel drive systems make their cars great in the snow???? And they spend money on these systems. The simple truth is that (driver aside) the most important thing is tires - way before all/4 wheel systems. This is the truth: I can't tell you how many spinning SUVs I pass in my 2 wheel drive, 4 snowed Porsche. These dopes just don't get it. Further, the car companies know that drivers are clueless and buyers want quiet, comfortable tires. So what do they put on their all/4 cars? Well they call them "all season" but they are clearly not. There is no such thing.

Get real snow tires and you don't need all/4 wheel drive systems.

Now for my "I'm a Dope" story:

By the way, I purchased an Lexus IS250 all wheel drive car for my wife (who is not a skilled driver) but, like a DOPE, I left the "all season" tires on last winter. What did my wife do with her new all wheel drive car? She put it right into a guard rail with the slightest of snow on the street ($14K of damage). So much for "all season" and all wheel drive cars. So this winter, I purchased a set of Lexus refurbed wheels and Blizzak snow tires all around. Now, when you combine great snow tires and an all wheel drive system, you got something. This car now goes through anything. I am flatly amazed at the traction in snow, slush, and yes, on ice. But make no mistake, it is snow tires above all else.

In fact, in the hands of most idiots, AWD just gets you to unsafe speeds faster. It does nothing to improve braking steering or cornering grip. We all have 4Wbrakes and 4 contact patches.

I really DO love my Audis in the snow, but that's with 4 snows and lots of skating away on the thin ice of the new day practice.

ps: anyone go to the QCUSA ice driving school in New Hampshire last weekend?

Grant

Yep, with the right tires these cars are actually great in the snow because they are well balanced and you can use the manual transmission / clutch to manage torque delivery.

I posted about this just after Christmas, having used both my Summers and Winters in the snow within a 1-week period. I mounted Continental Extreme Contact DWS (actually all-seasons) and they totally kick butt in the snow.

1998 986 Turbo-Look Cab
172,000 Miles
Dilithium Crystal Supercharger

He or she was most likely on performance summer tires which are worthless in cold, snow and ice. One time, many moons ago, I thought it would be fun to "drift" in 30 degree dry conditions, turned off the PSM and hit it. Believe me, a Bosxter will spin like a top when provoked. Thank God I didn't hit anything, a road sign went by about a foot from my front bumper. Summer performance tires don't grip in the cold. At all. Also, not many people in Texas are used to driving in cold and snow.
My son is in Houston trying out for Houston Dynamo soccer team and he said the dusting of snow played havoc on those Texans today. Practically closed the interstate due to so many wrecks.

...summer tires. Plus a mid-engined car will spin easily and keep spinning. Low moment of inertia. Is that bad? I say heck no. But if you are an idiot, and most drivers are, it has its side effects. A "safer" design for snow is a nose-heavy, FWD car with a propensity to continue going straight no matter what you do. Kinda compromises handling and agility, though :-)

I have 4 now tires on my boxster and have great respect for icy roads. Snow, OTOH, generally has plenty of predictable grip. Very cold sno is like fin, white sandpaper.

Grant

However our problem was a thin sliver of ice on all the roads.

I didn't see the clip, but FWIW, that was roughly 5" of snow on top of packed ice, here in Dallas and temperatures still in the 20's. Any Boxster here is likely on summer tires and those are not good in the cold.

Fact is, the traction starts going down as the temperature gets under 50 and degrades as it gets colder. A lot of drivers have really bad car control feel, and don't notice the difference until really cold. And the Summer tires are really bad on snow covered ice.

I was able to get around Friday, going roughly 30 mph in my Jetta Sportswagen. And I had someone in a sedan do a 180 out in front of me--I was looking well ahead, saw her start sliding, I stopped and waited for the spinning car to come to a rest. But a dummy behind me, flipped me off and drove around me, then realized why I stopped where I did. He ended up getting out of the way, but he clearly wasn't looking at his surroundings. I ended up driving around them both, going my way, only once I was sure they were done going all over the road.

It's absolutely true drivers down here don't know how to drive on bad roads--and that's the rub. As long as everyone stays in control, you can drive slowly. But if a car near you starts losing it, you need lots of space to get out of the way, because you are not going to stop or turn very quickly. The foolish drivers around here don't give other cars the space, to be able to steer around or stop to avoid accidents. I had several drivers right on my rear end or next to me, and thankfully they didn't slide into me. The accidents aren't usually too bad because they are generally at slow speeds, but I really hate risking my car sharing the roads with idiot drivers.

If you have power at all 4 corners, like my "driver" Sadie, it was a fun snow day.

Snow Day in Dallas

Current Porsche: PCA Club Coupe 2 of 50

Past: 02 986 S

01 996 Turbo

00 Millenium Coupe

99 996 C2

99 Boxster



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2011 12:30PM by Paul S.. (view changes)